June 2023: Embracing failure makes success even sweeter, right?

Pretotyping in action

Embracing failure makes success even sweeter, right?

In conversation:

An interview with Jack Simpson and Leslie Barry

Recently, I had the privilege of catching up with Jack Simpson, GM Product of Tabcorp, who interviewed me for their Customer Learning Academy about all things pretotyping, experimentation, success and — of course — failure. Check out some key quotes and insights from the interview below to learn more about the importance of embracing failure to get to sweet success 👇


"Pretotyping is not about nailing the best idea; it's about weeding out the bad ones sooner. It saves us money and valuable time. We're looking for failure over success more often than not. It's a bit counterintuitive, isn't it?"

This was a valid question raised by Jack Simpson at the beginning of our chat.
When you're rooting out ideas that seem fantastic on paper but fall flat when put to the test, you're essentially celebrating failure over success, aren't you? Is this the right way to go about it?


The self-proclaimed 'biggest failure'


"Think of me as the biggest failure you're ever going to meet," laughed Leslie Barry. "I've put two years of my life into three different ideas separately, only to realise they were terrible. They weren't solving a problem for anybody."

And yet, it's this very experience with failure that I attribute my success to!

"You've got to face the fact that failure is inevitable," Barry says. "We all pretend it doesn't happen, like it's some dirty little secret. But when it comes to investing millions of dollars or investing years of people's lives, failure isn't just probable; it's guaranteed."

Fail fast, learn fast: the Google way


"I remember hearing Astro Teller from Google at the Singularity Conference. He said that whenever someone brings an idea, they try to 'kill' it as fast as they can. If they can't, then it's worth pursuing. It struck me that they've turned failure into a strength, and that's been a game-changer for me," says Barry.

Are we doing innovation wrong?


In business, we often fall in love with an idea and convince everyone it's fantastic. We meticulously compile spreadsheets and guesstimate our way to success. But I believe that might not be the most efficient approach.

"Why not get rid of the unworkable ideas at the beginning?" Barry says.

Simpson candidly admits, "The first experiment that we killed was one that I had been sitting on for two years. And I'm happy to admit that it sucked, but I loved it."

The future of innovation: betting big and failing often


Most organisations want stability and sure bets, but innovation demands the opposite. As I see it, the future of innovation lies in "creating instability, breaking stuff, taking big bets, and learning from failure".

"I encourage organisations to embrace exponential innovation," Barry adds. "Look for under-the-radar opportunities in culture, technology, customer behaviour, regulations, and competitors. AI is an obvious one. It's new, it's powerful, and it's largely underutilised."

Don't forget to combine!


Finally, I urge people to consider combinatorial innovation.

"Take ideas, compound them, and create something new. Combine your existing assets and create something unique."

"Number one after that long story is stamina," Barry says. "Venture capital companies get a return after seven years. If you're not in for the long haul, you might as well not be in at all."

What are the takeaways?


  • Failure is inevitable, so fail fast and learn from it

  • Don't cling to unsuccessful ideas — kill your darlings!

  • Seek untapped opportunities and use combinatorial innovation to find and create unique solutions

There is no transcript or recording available to the public for this interview, but here's hoping these insights have opened up a new way of looking at failure for you. Remember, every failure is a stepping stone to massive success!

If you need help with experimentation in your organisation, look no further than our comprehensive Simple Innovation guide to help you get started 💡


Download the guide

One thing


"Innovation requires embracing failure. If you're not failing, you're not pushing your limits, and if you're not pushing your limits, you're not maximising your potential."

— Leslie Barry

Until next month, happy innovating!

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August 2023: Perfect is the enemy of good

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May 2023: Revealing Unknown Knowns